you either can grow the economy or you can protect the environment, okay. so i changed the question, and i've been doing this now for several years. i said, okay, here's the question: do you believe that protecting the environment harms the economy and costs jobs, has no impact on the economy or jobs, or actually grows the economy and improves jobs? okay, and what do we find? an overwhelming majority of america, now, i'm talking like two thirds of americans, say that it either has no impact or it actually improves the economy. in fact, that's the most frequently chosen answer is that most americans don't see this as an inherent contradiction. >> what you're saying is that a big powerful industry controls or affects the outcomes of perception in this country disproportionately to what most people think? >> that's right. and in part they're able to do that because this issue is a low talk about it and because there is no what we call issue public on the other side. >> what do you mean? >> okay, so an issue public is basically an organized social movement that